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Stop the casino

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    • Stop the casino

      There are plans on the table to build a new casino in tuxedo ,ny , almost adjacent to the trail

      ATC opposes the proposed Sterling Forest Resort in Tuxedo, New York, a casino development that would threaten the scenic beauty and integrity of the Appalachian Trail in Sterling Forest State Park.

      Find out more about our stance at tinyurl.com/kbdny8u, and share your opinions with the New York State Gaming Commission by emailing info@gaming.ny.gov or writing to PO Box 7500, Schenectady, NY 12301 before September 30.

      Will you support our efforts to stop the casino development and all of the vital ATC programs with a donation of $50, $75 or even $100?

      Your donation will go toward stopping the casino, our conservation efforts, public education, and our overall mission to preserve and protect the A.T.

      Thank you.
      Appalachian Trail Conservancy


      appalachiantrail.org/who-we-ar…resort-in-tuxedo-new-york
      its all good
    • Tuxedo and Woodbury are about 5 miles apart, yes.

      BOTH locations have proposed casino resorts.

      EITHER resort would be a disaster for Harriman and Sterling Forest parks. If either is built, it's 100% guaranteed that the additional traffic pressure will have to be accommodated by building an Exit 15B off the Thruway at either County Road 106 or Arden Valley Road (depending on which proposal is chosen), widening 17 to four lanes, and widening and straightening 17A and 106 through the parks, taking a good many acres of parkland (and ruining many more with cut and fill) to do it. The politicians say this won't happen, but don't have any alternative plan for handling the traffic. They just imagine that the traffic jams will change public opinion in favor of taking park land, once the resorts are built.

      Both proposals feature big hotels (the one proposed for Tuxedo is 1000 rooms and 7000 parking spaces), outdoor concert venues, and similar amenities. Either one breaks up conserved wildlife habitat and presents an eyesore to anyone at a viewpoint in the Ramapo range, either in Sterling Forest or on the west side of Harriman. The larger one would have its lights visible from Dater Mountain to Schunemunk.

      These proposals are shameful.

      Both plans also call for dismantling the old rail bridge over 17 south of Harriman. With the bridge gone, 17 winds up open to truckers looking to avoid the Thruway tolls. It already has a horrible accident rate, and adding 18-wheelers to the mix will surely not improve matters.
      I'm not lost. I know where I am. I'm right here.
    • AnotherKevin wrote:

      Tuxedo and Woodbury are about 5 miles apart, yes.

      BOTH locations have proposed casino resorts.

      EITHER resort would be a disaster for Harriman and Sterling Forest parks. If either is built, it's 100% guaranteed that the additional traffic pressure will have to be accommodated by building an Exit 15B off the Thruway at either County Road 106 or Arden Valley Road (depending on which proposal is chosen), widening 17 to four lanes, and widening and straightening 17A and 106 through the parks, taking a good many acres of parkland (and ruining many more with cut and fill) to do it. The politicians say this won't happen, but don't have any alternative plan for handling the traffic. They just imagine that the traffic jams will change public opinion in favor of taking park land, once the resorts are built.

      Both proposals feature big hotels (the one proposed for Tuxedo is 1000 rooms and 7000 parking spaces), outdoor concert venues, and similar amenities. Either one breaks up conserved wildlife habitat and presents an eyesore to anyone at a viewpoint in the Ramapo range, either in Sterling Forest or on the west side of Harriman. The larger one would have its lights visible from Dater Mountain to Schunemunk.

      These proposals are shameful.

      Both plans also call for dismantling the old rail bridge over 17 south of Harriman. With the bridge gone, 17 winds up open to truckers looking to avoid the Thruway tolls. It already has a horrible accident rate, and adding 18-wheelers to the mix will surely not improve matters.

      Im an Orange County resident, and as much as Im for revenue to off set tax hikes, this/these casinos will be a disaster. Woodbury Commons outlets already is a mess, specifically during the holidays. When I say a mess, I literally mean a mess!! The traffic is a nightmare and I avoid that area as much as I can. The entire Monroe/Woodbury area has changed dramatically since I moved up here in 2001 and every year it gets even worse. Everything Kevin said above is correct. I seriously don't know what these people are thinking.
      RIAP
    • of course it is lou. there is nothing to be gained by bringing legalized gambling to ny except to create more gamblers.for the same reason, i expect marijuana will be legalized for recreational use in all 50 states by the end of the decade.
      we cant control ourselves when it comes to spending money, so we have to find more and more revenue sources. this is a form of slavery.combined with the aggressive marketing of debt in this country it markets shortcuts to riches while ruining lives. ive seen people blowing their paychecks on lottery every week, waiting to hit the big one. never understanding the odds dont change no matter how often you're in the game.
      its all good
    • I've never spent a dime in a casino but I have taken advantage of free food in them, one thing that surprised me is that most of the folks spending money in them appear to be poor, or at least not wealthy, if I was going to gamble I'd take a real chance and take up farming for a living.
      I may grow old but I'll never grow up.
    • Re: Stop the casino

      I have been following the casino story for a few weeks and support the ATC in there efforts to stop this casino project and support them in their efforts to protect the "view shed". I am also a Sierra Club member and support them in similar efforts. Come on people join up and join in preserving our wilderness areas .
      "Dazed and Confused"
      Recycle, re-use, re-purpose
      Plant a tree
      Take a kid hiking
      Make a difference
    • hikerboy wrote:

      of course it is lou. there is nothing to be gained by bringing legalized gambling to ny except to create more gamblers.for the same reason, i expect marijuana will be legalized for recreational use in all 50 states by the end of the decade.
      we cant control ourselves when it comes to spending money, so we have to find more and more revenue sources. this is a form of slavery.combined with the aggressive marketing of debt in this country it markets shortcuts to riches while ruining lives. ive seen people blowing their paychecks on lottery every week, waiting to hit the big one. never understanding the odds dont change no matter how often you're in the game.


      They would be so much better off opening a Roth IRA or taking the matching contribution on their companies 401K. ?(
      The road to glory cannot be followed with much baggage.
      Richard Ewell, CSA General
    • Drybones wrote:

      I've never spent a dime in a casino but I have taken advantage of free food in them, one thing that surprised me is that most of the folks spending money in them appear to be poor, or at least not wealthy, if I was going to gamble I'd take a real chance and take up farming for a living.


      A fool and his money are soon parted.
      The road to glory cannot be followed with much baggage.
      Richard Ewell, CSA General
    • Astro wrote:

      hikerboy wrote:

      of course it is lou. there is nothing to be gained by bringing legalized gambling to ny except to create more gamblers.for the same reason, i expect marijuana will be legalized for recreational use in all 50 states by the end of the decade.
      we cant control ourselves when it comes to spending money, so we have to find more and more revenue sources. this is a form of slavery.combined with the aggressive marketing of debt in this country it markets shortcuts to riches while ruining lives. ive seen people blowing their paychecks on lottery every week, waiting to hit the big one. never understanding the odds dont change no matter how often you're in the game.


      They would be so much better off opening a Roth IRA or taking the matching contribution on their companies 401K. ?(


      No no no! We can't have people investing their own money. Social Security is the answer. The government knows better. The stock market is a gamble.....

      Sorry. Just having a flashback.
      Non hikers are about a psi shy of a legal ball.
    • BirdBrain wrote:

      Astro wrote:

      hikerboy wrote:

      of course it is lou. there is nothing to be gained by bringing legalized gambling to ny except to create more gamblers.for the same reason, i expect marijuana will be legalized for recreational use in all 50 states by the end of the decade.
      we cant control ourselves when it comes to spending money, so we have to find more and more revenue sources. this is a form of slavery.combined with the aggressive marketing of debt in this country it markets shortcuts to riches while ruining lives. ive seen people blowing their paychecks on lottery every week, waiting to hit the big one. never understanding the odds dont change no matter how often you're in the game.


      They would be so much better off opening a Roth IRA or taking the matching contribution on their companies 401K. ?(


      No no no! We can't have people investing their own money. Social Security is the answer. The government knows better. The stock market is a gamble.....

      Sorry. Just having a flashback.


      the stock market is a bigger gamble than most people think.its ridiculously inflated and billionaires like warren buffett have been dumping their holdings.the landscape and complexion of our financial markets has changed dramatically. historical valuation methods are no longer valid.
      but still, the point is slow and steady wins the race.too many get rich quick schemes targetting the people who can afford to lose the least.
      its all good
    • hikerboy wrote:

      BirdBrain wrote:

      Astro wrote:

      hikerboy wrote:

      of course it is lou. there is nothing to be gained by bringing legalized gambling to ny except to create more gamblers.for the same reason, i expect marijuana will be legalized for recreational use in all 50 states by the end of the decade.
      we cant control ourselves when it comes to spending money, so we have to find more and more revenue sources. this is a form of slavery.combined with the aggressive marketing of debt in this country it markets shortcuts to riches while ruining lives. ive seen people blowing their paychecks on lottery every week, waiting to hit the big one. never understanding the odds dont change no matter how often you're in the game.


      They would be so much better off opening a Roth IRA or taking the matching contribution on their companies 401K. ?(


      No no no! We can't have people investing their own money. Social Security is the answer. The government knows better. The stock market is a gamble.....

      Sorry. Just having a flashback.


      the stock market is a bigger gamble than most people think.its ridiculously inflated and billionaires like warren buffett have been dumping their holdings.the landscape and complexion of our financial markets has changed dramatically. historical valuation methods are no longer valid.
      but still, the point is slow and steady wins the race.too many get rich quick schemes targetting the people who can afford to lose the least.


      There all kinds of funds and types of financial instruments to diversify than just stocks (bonds, money market).
      The road to glory cannot be followed with much baggage.
      Richard Ewell, CSA General
    • I don't think the casinos should by right beside the AT. But I think the one they have in Cherokee works great and has done wonders for their economy. But it's not like Vegas. I go to Cherokee a few times a year and we are always disappointed. But there is great hiking and fishing in the area which also draws me in.

      Next Thursday we leave for our trip out west. Our first night is in Laughlin. Followed by a couple days in Sedona. Then off to the Grand Canyon for some backpacking followed up by putting kayaks in at Hoover Dam and going down river for an overnight at one of the hot springs. Then it's R&R in Vegas for 4 nights! We gamble. Sometimes we win, sometimes we brake even, and sometimes we lose. We know this before we ever step foot on the plane. We also enjoy the shows and buffets. We also love using Vegas as a base for exploring. This year it will be red rocks, telegraph peak, and a few ghost towns while we prospect for gold. We'll take our GPAA book for the hot gold areas and treasure hunting. We also are hoping to find a good concert to go and see and WIN BIG!!!
    • Re: Stop the casino

      Dmax ,

      at the GC i recommend a day hike down the grand view trail to horse shoe mesa (cache water on way down ) or hermit trail to st maria spring or dripping spring. much better than bright angel
      "Dazed and Confused"
      Recycle, re-use, re-purpose
      Plant a tree
      Take a kid hiking
      Make a difference
    • jimmyjam wrote:

      Dmax ,

      at the GC i recommend a day hike down the grand view trail to horse shoe mesa (cache water on way down ) or hermit trail to st maria spring or dripping spring. much better than bright angel


      This trip we are doing Havasu Falls and staying there for three nights and later in the week we plan on coming back for a day hike on the hermit trail. We did the bright angel a few years ago with a cheap stay in the cabins at the trailhead during the off season. I'll keep grand view on our radar.
    • Dmax wrote:

      jimmyjam wrote:

      Dmax ,

      at the GC i recommend a day hike down the grand view trail to horse shoe mesa (cache water on way down ) or hermit trail to st maria spring or dripping spring. much better than bright angel


      This trip we are doing Havasu Falls and staying there for three nights and later in the week we plan on coming back for a day hike on the hermit trail. We did the bright angel a few years ago with a cheap stay in the cabins at the trailhead during the off season. I'll keep grand view on our radar.


      You lucky duck! I've been wanting to see Havasu Falls. Just in case you don't already know, don't go near the top of the falls-many have fallen, and there is some flash flood danger at the bottom of Havasu Canyon. Grand View Trail is very steep and has some exposure, but the views are breath taking.
      "Dazed and Confused"
      Recycle, re-use, re-purpose
      Plant a tree
      Take a kid hiking
      Make a difference
    • I don't get it. On line gambling - directly caused by Dingy Harry of Las Vagas Nevada as a senator who had gambling lining his pockets for running - ran the bill into law. Putting thousands of union workers out of a job when 6 major casino's in Atlantic City Casino's closing or about to close. A small casino or crappy hotel next to the trail is of little consequence to the objective of completing the trail.


      After some considerable thought of this, ... am I wrong?
      Be wise enough to walk away from the nonsense around you! :thumbup:
    • WiseOldOwl wrote:

      ....... A small casino or crappy hotel next to the trail is of little consequence to the objective of completing the trail.


      After some considerable thought of this, ... am I wrong?


      What you say is correct BUT, for those of us that use Harriman State Park, Sterling Forest and other nearby lands it will be a nightmare.
      More traffic, more uninformed people in the woods, and more crowds in that whole area. Did you ever try to get to NY's Bear Mountain on the 4th of July? It's already near impossible, add more stress to the area and it may be like that every weekend or holiday.
    • LIhikers wrote:

      What you say is correct BUT, for those of us that use Harriman State Park, Sterling Forest and other nearby lands it will be a nightmare.
      More traffic, more uninformed people in the woods, and more crowds in that whole area.


      And the traffic will require road improvements, which will require the taking of park land to build them. In an area that already contains the only spot where the A-T crosses a freeway at grade. The proposed Exit 15B on the Thruway was withdrawn from the proposal when the Palisades Interstate Park Commission nixed it. But the PIPC can't block the state legislatures from repurposing the land, which is what will happen - virtually 100% guaranteed - if the proposal passes. Because at that point they won't be able to withdraw the permit to build the thing, and will have to deal with the traffic somehow.
      I'm not lost. I know where I am. I'm right here.
    • rafe wrote:

      Astro wrote:


      They would be so much better off opening a Roth IRA or taking the matching contribution on their companies 401K. ?(


      Only the best (or better) jobs offer 401Ks. Professional or semi-professional work.


      Anyone can open a Roth IRA. The point being steadily putting money away is a much better strategy than constantly throwing money away trying to win the big one.

      feedthepig.org/manage-your-mon…ccount-types#.VCQcYbE3e94
      The road to glory cannot be followed with much baggage.
      Richard Ewell, CSA General
    • Astro wrote:

      rafe wrote:

      Astro wrote:


      They would be so much better off opening a Roth IRA or taking the matching contribution on their companies 401K. ?(


      Only the best (or better) jobs offer 401Ks. Professional or semi-professional work.


      Anyone can open a Roth IRA. The point being steadily putting money away is a much better strategy than constantly throwing money away trying to win the big one.

      feedthepig.org/manage-your-mon…ccount-types#.VCQcYbE3e94


      it depends how you want to spend different vacation time. We have both an IRA and 401k.

      Do you go out to movies?
      Do you go out and eat at restaurants?
      Do you spend money to go on a section hike?

      All money spent like this could but put away and saved for retirement.
      We don't do movies and restaurants and put that money aside for vacations. Doesn't matter to us if its a hike on the AT, a trip to a casino, or a week at the beach.

      Seems like this is a mixed thread. Some are against gambling. That's ok. Some are against development near the trail. That's ok. And some don't want new roads built. That's ok too. But I for one will visit the casino near the trail if it is built and at least eat at the buffet.
    • hikerboy wrote:

      BirdBrain wrote:

      Astro wrote:

      hikerboy wrote:

      of course it is lou. there is nothing to be gained by bringing legalized gambling to ny except to create more gamblers.for the same reason, i expect marijuana will be legalized for recreational use in all 50 states by the end of the decade.
      we cant control ourselves when it comes to spending money, so we have to find more and more revenue sources. this is a form of slavery.combined with the aggressive marketing of debt in this country it markets shortcuts to riches while ruining lives. ive seen people blowing their paychecks on lottery every week, waiting to hit the big one. never understanding the odds dont change no matter how often you're in the game.


      They would be so much better off opening a Roth IRA or taking the matching contribution on their companies 401K. ?(


      No no no! We can't have people investing their own money. Social Security is the answer. The government knows better. The stock market is a gamble.....

      Sorry. Just having a flashback.


      the stock market is a bigger gamble than most people think.its ridiculously inflated and billionaires like warren buffett have been dumping their holdings.the landscape and complexion of our financial markets has changed dramatically. historical valuation methods are no longer valid.
      but still, the point is slow and steady wins the race.too many get rich quick schemes targetting the people who can afford to lose the least.


      It's likely to bite me in the ass like a gator in the near future, but the market has treated me well over the years.
      I may grow old but I'll never grow up.
    • OK I went on Google Earth and its less than a mile from the trail... Its also a mile from town in the other direction... these casinos have a 20 year run - so does DVD, VHS, & the Wankel engine-Folks go ahead and fight the big fight. Half of Las Vegas is empty and barren in the center as bad as a balloon. Today's boon is to-morrows bust and its all about political fund raising and taxes. There isn't a way to open casinos in the face of the internet's current power. Investors will see the light with Atlantic City's closings.

      With a little "small" sarcasm - World Peace!




      Lets go hiking.
      Be wise enough to walk away from the nonsense around you! :thumbup: