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Being Safe on the AT - Weapon Safety

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    • When looking at handguns, keep in mind that technology and the ballistic qualities of ammunition is changing rapidly. The FBI, which had been using 40S&W since the late 1980's made a switch back to 9mm in recent years, largely because tests of newly available ammunition determined that modern 9mm, 40S&W, and 45acp rounds performed equally well and that agents were able to fire more quickly and more accurately using lower recoil 9mm round.


      loadoutroom.com/12077/fbi-going-9mm-comes-science/
      FBI 9MM Justification
      FBI Training Division: FBI Academy, Quantico, VA
      Executive Summary of Justification for Law Enforcement Partners
      · Caliber debates have existed in law enforcement for decades
      · Most of what is “common knowledge” with ammunition and its effects on the human target are rooted in myth and folklore
      · Projectiles are what ultimately wound our adversaries and the projectile needs to be the basis for the discussion on what “caliber” is best
      · In all the major law enforcement calibers there exist projectiles which have a high likelihood of failing LEO’s in a shooting incident and there are projectiles which have a high ting incident likelihood of succeeding for LEOs in a shooting incident
      · Handgun stopping power is simply a myth
      · The single most important factor in effectively wounding a human target is to have penetration to a scientifically valid depth (FBI uses 12” – 18”)
      · LEOs miss between 70 – 80 percent of the shots fired during a shooting incident
      · Contemporary projectiles (since 2007) have dramatically increased the terminal effectiveness of many premium line law enforcement projectiles (emphasis on the 9mm Luger offerings)
      · 9mm Luger now offers select projectiles which are, under identical testing conditions, I outperforming most of the premium line .40 S&W and .45 Auto projectiles tested by the FBI
      · 9mm Luger offers higher magazine capacities, less recoil, lower cost (both in ammunition and wear on the weapons) and higher functional reliability rates (in FBI weapons)
      · The majority of FBI shooters are both FASTER in shot strings fired and more ACCURATE with shooting a 9mm Luger vs shooting a .40 S&W (similar sized weapons)
      · There is little to no noticeable difference in the wound tracks between premium line law Auto enforcement projectiles from 9mm Luger through the .45 Auto
      · Given contemporary bullet construction, LEO’s can field (with proper bullet selection) 9mm Lugers with all of the terminal performance potential of any other law enforcement pistol caliber with none of the disadvantages present with the “larger” calibers
      >>>Advertise here! Affordable rates and no long term contracts. Send a PM for more details!<<<
    • jimmyjam wrote:

      If you do your own reloading, the 45 long colt can be loaded to be more powerful than even the 44 magnum- so I've read.
      Yep. Or, you can get .45Colt in +P from Buffalo Bore. This particular round would be bear-adequate...but, you cannot shoot it through anything but a big frame Ruger. Although, I wouldn't see why you couldn't shoot it through a SW Model 25...

      buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=38
    • Drybones wrote:

      I'm sure ya'll heard about the lady that proved a small .25 could stop a grizzly?

      You are joking right?


      Learn how a woman was able to stop a Grizzly from attacking her with one shot of her 25 caliber pistol. April 2013
      This is a story of self control and marksmanship with an itsy bitsy shooter by a woman against a fierce predator.
      What is the smallest caliber you trust to protect yourself? The Beretta Jetfire.
      “While out hiking in Alberta Canada with my boyfriend we were surprised by a huge grizzly bear charging at us from out of nowhere. She must have been
      protecting her cubs because she was extremely aggressive.
      If I had not had my little Beretta Jetfire with me I would not be here today!
      Just one shot to my boyfriend’s knee cap was all it took… The bear got him, and I was able to escape by just walking away at a brisk pace.
      It’s one of the best pistols in my collection!”

      Real Story
      nationalparkstraveler.com/2010…nal-park-and-preserve5943
      Be wise enough to walk away from the nonsense around you! :thumbup:
    • Drybones wrote:

      TrafficJam wrote:

      That glock 29 does look good...about 2lbs. That should fit comfortably in my skirt pocket. Been thinking about how to sew a holster into the pocket.
      Boys....you just gotta love this woman!
      Let's see:

      hikes, shoots, makes stuff, drinks whiskey, takes no crap off us, what's not to like?
      "Dazed and Confused"
      Recycle, re-use, re-purpose
      Plant a tree
      Take a kid hiking
      Make a difference

      The post was edited 1 time, last by jimmyjam ().

    • Wise Old Owl wrote:

      Drybones wrote:

      I'm sure ya'll heard about the lady that proved a small .25 could stop a grizzly?
      You are joking right?


      Learn how a woman was able to stop a Grizzly from attacking her with one shot of her 25 caliber pistol. April 2013
      This is a story of self control and marksmanship with an itsy bitsy shooter by a woman against a fierce predator.
      What is the smallest caliber you trust to protect yourself? The Beretta Jetfire.
      “While out hiking in Alberta Canada with my boyfriend we were surprised by a huge grizzly bear charging at us from out of nowhere. She must have been
      protecting her cubs because she was extremely aggressive.
      If I had not had my little Beretta Jetfire with me I would not be here today!
      Just one shot to my boyfriend’s knee cap was all it took… The bear got him, and I was able to escape by just walking away at a brisk pace.
      It’s one of the best pistols in my collection!”

      Real Story
      nationalparkstraveler.com/2010…nal-park-and-preserve5943
      That was a .45acp and it took 9 rounds...bear still made it a 100 yards after...

      With a .25acp, you'd need to shoot both a bear's eyes out and run before he scent-tracked you...
    • jimmyjam wrote:

      Drybones wrote:

      TrafficJam wrote:

      That glock 29 does look good...about 2lbs. That should fit comfortably in my skirt pocket. Been thinking about how to sew a holster into the pocket.
      Boys....you just gotta love this woman!
      Let's see:
      hikes, shoots, makes stuff, drinks whiskey, takes no crap off us, what's not to like?
      I'm really a 40 yr old bald guy who lives with his mother. :P


      Seriously, y'all stop please. :)
      In life there are no limitations. Except stupidity. If you're stupid, you're screwed.

      Stephan Pastis
    • jimmyjam wrote:

      Drybones wrote:

      TrafficJam wrote:

      That glock 29 does look good...about 2lbs. That should fit comfortably in my skirt pocket. Been thinking about how to sew a holster into the pocket.
      Boys....you just gotta love this woman!
      Let's see:
      hikes, shoots, makes stuff, drinks whiskey, takes no crap off us, what's not to like?
      With all the stuff she's in to I don't see how she finds time to spend here....I don't do doodlie swat and I have trouble finding time.
      I may grow old but I'll never grow up.
    • TrafficJam wrote:

      Not too sure about that Denali bear shooting and have to agree with some of the comments to the article. Maybe a knee jerk reaction? I guess it's hard to second guess.
      It is a tough call. Bear comes charging out of the brush. Do you draw and wait to see if it is a bluff charge? Every second he closes the distance is one less second to get it right in about three seconds total...plus..its a bear...they shot AT it 9 times...emptied the gun...and it still made it 100 yards from the shooting....fortunately not in their direction. I think that is where the second guessing is coming from...the bear going the other way, back into the brush...after being shot 9 times with a .45acp...

      I have to say, if I didn't have a gun(and I don't carry on the AT...sorry to dispel any myth/rumor), I'd hope the sound and smell of the crap leaving me would deter the bear charging me...but if you've ever seen a grizz with it's head in a moose...yeah...bear don't care...

      Reminds me of that poor misguided soul...Timothy Treadwell...he finally learned...bear...don't...care...
    • jimmyjam wrote:

      Drybones wrote:

      TrafficJam wrote:

      That glock 29 does look good...about 2lbs. That should fit comfortably in my skirt pocket. Been thinking about how to sew a holster into the pocket.
      Boys....you just gotta love this woman!
      Let's see:
      hikes, shoots, makes stuff, drinks whiskey, takes no crap off us, what's not to like?
      and likes dogs.

      Lest we forget.....



      SSgt Ray Rangel - USAF
      SrA Elizabeth Loncki - USAF
      PFC Adam Harris - USA
      MSgt Eden Pearl - USMC
    • SandyofPA wrote:

      Dan76 wrote:

      SandyofPA wrote:

      You boys just don't know what you might find out about the hiking girls if you keep hanging out in our threads! :P
      Hopefully we'll be pleasantly surprised.
      I hike, make hiking gear, shoot (I have a real cute Ruger Bearcat, and a Henry rifle, both shoot LR22), don't take crap off anyone, drink tea, and love dogs.
      Female hikers are cool! :thumbup:
      In life there are no limitations. Except stupidity. If you're stupid, you're screwed.

      Stephan Pastis
    • ScareBear wrote:

      TrafficJam wrote:

      Not too sure about that Denali bear shooting and have to agree with some of the comments to the article. Maybe a knee jerk reaction? I guess it's hard to second guess.
      It is a tough call. Bear comes charging out of the brush. Do you draw and wait to see if it is a bluff charge? Every second he closes the distance is one less second to get it right in about three seconds total...plus..its a bear...they shot AT it 9 times...emptied the gun...and it still made it 100 yards from the shooting....fortunately not in their direction. I think that is where the second guessing is coming from...the bear going the other way, back into the brush...after being shot 9 times with a .45acp...
      I have to say, if I didn't have a gun(and I don't carry on the AT...sorry to dispel any myth/rumor), I'd hope the sound and smell of the crap leaving me would deter the bear charging me...but if you've ever seen a grizz with it's head in a moose...yeah...bear don't care...

      Reminds me of that poor misguided soul...Timothy Treadwell...he finally learned...bear...don't...care...
      One of the arguments about allowing weapons is that they are used in place of dong the other things you're supposed to do to ward off an attack. But who knows which grizzly is going to be one that doesn't run when you shout and wave your arms and eats you instead? Hindsight is 20-20. I don't know...just hope people aren't morons, use good judgement, and don't kill unnecessarily.
      In life there are no limitations. Except stupidity. If you're stupid, you're screwed.

      Stephan Pastis
    • SandyofPA wrote:

      Dan76 wrote:

      SandyofPA wrote:

      You boys just don't know what you might find out about the hiking girls if you keep hanging out in our threads! :P
      Hopefully we'll be pleasantly surprised.
      I hike, make hiking gear, shoot (I have a real cute Ruger Bearcat, and a Henry rifle, both shoot LR22), don't take crap off anyone, drink tea, and love dogs.
      Y'all are awesome. All the ladies on here are cool.
      "Dazed and Confused"
      Recycle, re-use, re-purpose
      Plant a tree
      Take a kid hiking
      Make a difference
    • SandyofPA wrote:

      Dan76 wrote:

      SandyofPA wrote:

      You boys just don't know what you might find out about the hiking girls if you keep hanging out in our threads! :P
      Hopefully we'll be pleasantly surprised.
      I hike, make hiking gear, shoot (I have a real cute Ruger Bearcat, and a Henry rifle, both shoot LR22), don't take crap off anyone, drink tea, and love dogs.
      Henry rifles are cool.

      Lest we forget.....



      SSgt Ray Rangel - USAF
      SrA Elizabeth Loncki - USAF
      PFC Adam Harris - USA
      MSgt Eden Pearl - USMC
    • I added a SIG P226 9mm to the collection a while back. I LOVE the thing, but it's weight would definitely pull your skirt down. If ya wanna try it on for size sometime just holler....

      For hiking, I still recommend the KelTec PMR30. Yes, I get that it's a .22 mag, but it's a.) light (just over 19 oz fully loaded with 30 rounds) and b.) extremely accurate. Even with the light weight there's very little recoil. Follow up shots happen real quick because the recoil simply doesn't pull you off target.
      If your Doctor is a tree, you're on acid.
    • TrafficJam wrote:

      ScareBear wrote:

      TrafficJam wrote:

      Not too sure about that Denali bear shooting and have to agree with some of the comments to the article. Maybe a knee jerk reaction? I guess it's hard to second guess.
      It is a tough call. Bear comes charging out of the brush. Do you draw and wait to see if it is a bluff charge? Every second he closes the distance is one less second to get it right in about three seconds total...plus..its a bear...they shot AT it 9 times...emptied the gun...and it still made it 100 yards from the shooting....fortunately not in their direction. I think that is where the second guessing is coming from...the bear going the other way, back into the brush...after being shot 9 times with a .45acp...I have to say, if I didn't have a gun(and I don't carry on the AT...sorry to dispel any myth/rumor), I'd hope the sound and smell of the crap leaving me would deter the bear charging me...but if you've ever seen a grizz with it's head in a moose...yeah...bear don't care...

      Reminds me of that poor misguided soul...Timothy Treadwell...he finally learned...bear...don't...care...
      One of the arguments about allowing weapons is that they are used in place of dong the other things you're supposed to do to ward off an attack. But who knows which grizzly is going to be one that doesn't run when you shout and wave your arms and eats you instead? Hindsight is 20-20. I don't know...just hope people aren't morons, use good judgement, and don't kill unnecessarily.
      I presume we all know there's a big difference between grizzlies and black bears?
      In life there are no limitations. Except stupidity. If you're stupid, you're screwed.

      Stephan Pastis
    • Dan76 wrote:

      SandyofPA wrote:

      Dan76 wrote:

      SandyofPA wrote:

      You boys just don't know what you might find out about the hiking girls if you keep hanging out in our threads! :P
      Hopefully we'll be pleasantly surprised.
      I hike, make hiking gear, shoot (I have a real cute Ruger Bearcat, and a Henry rifle, both shoot LR22), don't take crap off anyone, drink tea, and love dogs.
      Henry rifles are cool.
      My dad gave me a Henry Golden Boy in 44 mag. Really wanna shoot a deer with it.
      I carry a pistol most all the time. I'm a huge Glock fan and my go to carry gun is the 43.

      Hiker women are awesome.

      I like dogs......and coffee...and bacon...


      That's all I've got to say...prolly
      bacon can solve most any problem.
    • Dan76 wrote:

      SandyofPA wrote:

      Dan76 wrote:

      SandyofPA wrote:

      You boys just don't know what you might find out about the hiking girls if you keep hanging out in our threads! :P
      Hopefully we'll be pleasantly surprised.
      I hike, make hiking gear, shoot (I have a real cute Ruger Bearcat, and a Henry rifle, both shoot LR22), don't take crap off anyone, drink tea, and love dogs.
      Henry rifles are cool.
      Bearcats are cool, I've wanted one of those little guys for years, would be a good gun to take fishing and shoot cotton mouths with.
      I may grow old but I'll never grow up.
    • SandyofPA wrote:

      Dan76 wrote:

      SandyofPA wrote:

      You boys just don't know what you might find out about the hiking girls if you keep hanging out in our threads! :P
      Hopefully we'll be pleasantly surprised.
      I hike, make hiking gear, shoot (I have a real cute Ruger Bearcat, and a Henry rifle, both shoot LR22), don't take crap off anyone, drink tea, and love dogs.
      I misread the post and clearly I was rude - my opoligy's Sandy
      Be wise enough to walk away from the nonsense around you! :thumbup:

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Wise Old Owl: Obvious ().

    • Wise Old Owl wrote:

      SandyofPA wrote:

      Dan76 wrote:

      SandyofPA wrote:

      You boys just don't know what you might find out about the hiking girls if you keep hanging out in our threads! :P
      Hopefully we'll be pleasantly surprised.
      I hike, make hiking gear, shoot (I have a real cute Ruger Bearcat, and a Henry rifle, both shoot LR22), don't take crap off anyone, drink tea, and love dogs.
      Honest we don't give a damn - we are father's, grandparents, military, and above all as men we are held accountable and "responsible" If you can fend for yourself so much the better...Good for you Sandy for having your act together and I hope good parents. I like street smarts and trail smart. If you haven't noticed real men don't need a separate thread. This was posted more for those that do not have your skill set, and surprisingly I do not hike with a weapon, but that may change as I am 55 in April. This was never posted to the weaker - this was posted to be informative for everyone. On a very personal level I attempt to stay out of these threads, unless I have something valuable to offer.
      What the hell have you been smoking man?...that was pretty rude and uncalled for...BTW, don't include me as "we", I do give a damn.
      I may grow old but I'll never grow up.